Forums: Rules Questions: So.... What precisely is precision damage...? (2024)

I was looking through the Grand Book... well, the Pdf version, because Denamrk is the Kingdom of Far Far Away!, and i yet again stumbled upon the term precision damage. As in: using Vital strike dont factor in precision damage and all that, and it mentions sneak attack as an example. In an old thread Jason says it will be adressed in the final version, but either I can't find it, or it sort of slipped past inspection and wasn't adressed.

So I know precision damage is: Sneak attack, Duelist precise strike or whatever it's called but what else?

Fighter's Weapon Specialization? His weapon traing bonus? Favored Enemy of the Ranger? Power Attack damage?

what gives?

I know we have some geniouses out there able to answer this, right? ;-)

Precision based damage is always Classfeature extra Damage isn`t it?

Sneakattack for Rogues.
Skirmish for Scouts.
(Favoured Enemy for Rangers. Don`t know for sure)
Elegant Strike für Duelists.
The Classfeature of the Swashbuckler and that kind of stuff.

All those Abilitys wich add Level dependend Extra Damage based on a DEX/INT based Action.

But i look forward to some precise Answer. Mine is surely way squishy *g*

Edit: Ah and additionaly those Features having a Sentence in the description like "Those extra Damage is not multiplied by critical hits"

This is the case for sneak damage and is also by skirmish...

The Hypertext d20 seemed to suggest that ranger favored enemy damage is precision, but it only seems to be mentioned in the Epic section, not the Manyshot feat. So that part is unclear.

It might have been nice to describe those types of damage as precision damage. "When a rogue sneak attacks, she causes an extra amount of precision damage", etc.

Gworeth wrote:

I was looking through the Grand Book... well, the Pdf version, because Denamrk is the Kingdom of Far Far Away!, and i yet again stumbled upon the term precision damage. As in: using Vital strike dont factor in precision damage and all that, and it mentions sneak attack as an example. In an old thread Jason says it will be adressed in the final version, but either I can't find it, or it sort of slipped past inspection and wasn't adressed.

So I know precision damage is: Sneak attack, Duelist precise strike or whatever it's called but what else?

Fighter's Weapon Specialization? His weapon traing bonus? Favored Enemy of the Ranger? Power Attack damage?

what gives?

I know we have some geniouses out there able to answer this, right? ;-)

Not to sound snarky but...

Precision damage is labeled as such. Sneak attack states its precision damage, as does a dualists precise strike. Other abilities will state if they are or not. If it doesn't state in the abilities rule that its precision damage, it isn't.

Or at least thats the rule of thumb me and my group go by. And make sure to check errata =)

Thanks y'all!

It helps alot. Oh! And you all rock, of course :-)

Krigare wrote:

Not to sound snarky but...

Precision damage is labeled as such. Sneak attack states its precision damage, as does a dualists precise strike. Other abilities will state if they are or not. If it doesn't state in the abilities rule that its precision damage, it isn't.

Or at least thats the rule of thumb me and my group go by. And make sure to check errata =)

Not to sound snarky but... ;-)

Sneak attack doesn't state that it is precision damage. The word "Precision" only appears 9 times in the entire book:

• Crippling Strike rogue talent (and meant as a synonym of "accuracy")
  
• Feats section(Greater Vital Strike, Improved Vital Strike, Manyshot, Vital Strike
  
• Critical hits
  
• Throwing splash weapons
  
• Darkness (also mentions the dualist's Precise Strike ability)
  
• Under Blindsight and Blindsense (but this has nothing to do with dealing damage)

As you can see, two of those cases doesn't have anything to do with precision damage. The rest refers only to sneak attack damage (and one of them to the Precise Strike ability) and thus we can infer that sneak attack damage is precision damage - but nothing in the description of sneak attack itself lists it as precision damage.
And again, from what can be observed above, only two types of specific damage is listed as precision damage... so, are these the only two or would it be possible to get a complete list?
Jason?
James?
Anyone? :-)

Seems to me that the notion of "precision damage" might be in the same category as "iterative attack,"—a useful game term that for whatever reason is never defined. And since it's not defined, you see the word precision pop up as descriptive text.

Precision damage is, basically, extra damage caused by placing a blow in a precise spot where the damage is more damaging than a simple blow. That's basically the same thing that's going on with a sneak attack or a duelist's precise strike, and it's also what's going on with a critical hit.

Weapon Specialization doesn't care about precision; neither do things like Power Attack or even a ranger's favored enemy ability, since these abilities simply increase the damage done by something EVERY TIME you hit. There's no flavor text associated with these attacks that specifically say you're specifically trying to stab someone in a heart. I suppose you could make a case, theme-wise, that the favored enemy damage should count, but in the rules as written it does not.

So basically—as far as I read it, precision damage is a handy way of summarizing "extra damage from critical hits, extra damage from sneak attacks, and extra damage from a duelist's precise strike ability."

Vital Strike's problem isn't really the mention of precision damage, but it's over-explanation of what it does. All it does is let you roll the actual dice you roll for the weapon's value twice. Other dice or modifiers you might add to that base weapon damage is not increased.

In the end, since "precision" is not a specific quantified rules element, whenever it appears you shouldn't attach rules assumptions to it. It's just a word; we could have used any other word in its place that's a synonym, like "preciseness" or "accuracy."

So in the end, it all comes down to the size of your... weapon when you have to figure out the potential benefit of Vital strike. I mean, much more satisfying to whack a dose of Vital Strike with your greatsword than your trusty albeit rather flimsy longsword, innit? And it would even be considered silly to do it with a dagger... I know, not all options are as viable in all curcomstances... But things are getting clearer for me..

Thanks James!

James Jacobs wrote:

Seems to me that the notion of "precision damage" might be in the same category as "iterative attack,"—a useful game term that for whatever reason is never defined. And since it's not defined, you see the word precision pop up as descriptive text.

Precision damage is, basically, extra damage caused by placing a blow in a precise spot where the damage is more damaging than a simple blow. That's basically the same thing that's going on with a sneak attack or a duelist's precise strike, and it's also what's going on with a critical hit.

Weapon Specialization doesn't care about precision; neither do things like Power Attack or even a ranger's favored enemy ability, since these abilities simply increase the damage done by something EVERY TIME you hit. There's no flavor text associated with these attacks that specifically say you're specifically trying to stab someone in a heart. I suppose you could make a case, theme-wise, that the favored enemy damage should count, but in the rules as written it does not.

So basically—as far as I read it, precision damage is a handy way of summarizing "extra damage from critical hits, extra damage from sneak attacks, and extra damage from a duelist's precise strike ability."

Vital Strike's problem isn't really the mention of precision damage, but it's over-explanation of what it does. All it does is let you roll the actual dice you roll for the weapon's value twice. Other dice or modifiers you might add to that base weapon damage is not increased.

In the end, since "precision" is not a specific quantified rules element, whenever it appears you shouldn't attach rules assumptions to it. It's just a word; we could have used any other word in its place that's a synonym, like "preciseness" or "accuracy."

Sorry to bring back a really old thread, but I have a related question, and it's better to post in an existing thread than make a new one if there's something to already build on.

The Pathfinder Campaign Setting section on firearms says (with regard to the blunderbuss and scattergun:
This firearm deals 1 die less damage per range increment beyond the first. It cannot deal precision-based damage, such as from a
sneak attack or from attacking a ranger’s favored enemy.

This indicates that favored enemy is in fact precision damage.

What if I have favored enemy(ooze)? Oozes are immune to precision based damage. Does favored enemy still apply on them? What about if I try to hit my favored enemy(ooze) with a scattergun?

Occam's Razor says that the campaign setting has a typo, but I'd just like to make sure.

Occam's Razor is right and wrong -- the campaign setting was written for 3.5 which had the favored enemy damage as precision, while the pathfinder game doesn't (this was a change).

So it's not a typo but it is different from 3.5 and the rules at the time the campaign setting came out.

Abraham spalding wrote:

Occam's Razor is right and wrong -- the campaign setting was written for 3.5 which had the favored enemy damage as precision, while the pathfinder game doesn't (this was a change).

So it's not a typo but it is different from 3.5 and the rules at the time the campaign setting came out.

This also makes sense. Thank you.

in 3.5 favored enemy damage wasnt precision, it worked on undead and constructs, oozes, ect.

3.0 it didn't work on undead (and probably the others) thats probably where it was precision damage.