VPfree2 vs. VPInsider discussed in Video Poker/Gambling at Wizard of Vegas (2024)

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Quote: tringlomane

Yeah, because that's the info I want sometimes. I have been yelling at the VPFree forum today of some people's bad habit of not listing 9/6 DDB (98.98%) and "Airport Deuces" (98.91%) as "playable games".

I think I catch a hint of sarcasm, maybe not, but there are games that are not posted on vpfree2 that are "good" games based on factoring in the slot club comp calculation. As an example the JOB SXP game in Laughlin at Harrahs. Plus there are new games added to the casino quite frequently and you never know when a vp table could change.

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Quote: SONBP2

I think I catch a hint of sarcasm, maybe not, but there are games that are not posted on vpfree2 that are "good" games based on factoring in the slot club comp calculation. As an example the JOB SXP game in Laughlin at Harrahs. Plus there are new games added to the casino quite frequently and you never know when a vp table could change.

VPfree is based on people writing in where the games are located, and when they are removed. Since it's based on community output, sometimes there will be great plays that don't get written up because people don't want others to burn it out. If you found a great +EV play wouldn't you keep it to yourself as long as possible and milk it?

"Man Babes" #AxelFabulous

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It looks like something I might sign up for if i didn't know about stuff that's already free.

But, no, I don't know what you get for $35

There's no secret. Just know what you're talking about before you open your mouth.

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Quote: SONBP2

I think I catch a hint of sarcasm, maybe not, but there are games that are not posted on vpfree2 that are "good" games based on factoring in the slot club comp calculation. As an example the JOB SXP game in Laughlin at Harrahs. Plus there are new games added to the casino quite frequently and you never know when a vp table could change.

Well, I am a bit bitter with VPFree2 at times because I posted this spring that 5-play "Build a Wheel" existed at Horseshoe Tunica for 9/6 DDB (99.11% w/Build a Wheel). It was relegated to a comment and Horseshoe Tunica still has the dreaded "Nothing Good" status (because all their other games are ~97% or worse). But at least one damn game is above 99%, which is the threshold to them for a "good game"...lol Every other addition I have submitted has been added though.

And it's inconsistent, some places in Vegas and elsewhere list sub 99% games when 99%+ are available but others don't. Personally I feel like you should just list them all (at least best by game type and/or denomination) and let readers choose. Of course I would feel this way because I am often playing nickels because I am poor and finding 99%+ nickels is nearly impossible except for off-strip Vegas (Casino Royale is close with 98.91% Deuces). :(

Quote: SONBP2

Yes I would, but its real nice that people post it on vpfree2. Just wanted to know if anyone knew if VPinsider.com had some additional information that couldn't be gained from vpfree2

Yeah even the play that chauncey posted earlier this week isn't on vpfree2 either...lol

Unfortunately, I dont subscribe to VPinsider, so I have no clue what kind of info they offer. Looking at their webpage, I'm not convinced it's worth the money though, especially since I am just a Vegas tourist.

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Quote: tringlomane

Well, I am a bit bitter with VPFree2 at times because I posted this spring that 5-play "Build a Wheel" existed at Horseshoe Tunica for 9/6 DDB (99.11% w/Build a Wheel). It was relegated to a comment and Horseshoe Tunica still has the dreaded "Nothing Good" status (because all their other games are ~97% or worse). But at least one damn game is above 99%, which is the threshold to them for a "good game"...lol Every other addition I have submitted has been added though.

And it's inconsistent, some places in Vegas and elsewhere list sub 99% games when 99%+ are available but others don't. Personally I feel like you should just list them all (at least best by game type and/or denomination) and let readers choose. Of course I would feel this way because I am often playing nickels because I am poor and finding 99%+ nickels is nearly impossible except for off-strip Vegas (Casino Royale is close with 98.91% Deuces). :(

Yeah even the play that chauncey posted earlier this week isn't on vpfree2 either...lol

Unfortunately, I dont subscribe to VPinsider, so I have no clue what kind of info they offer. Looking at their webpage, I'm not convinced it's worth the money though, especially since I am just a Vegas tourist.

VPFree2 is Vegas-centric. That could be because there are so many great games out there, and many of the "pros" live out there too. If they didn't take your submission I guess that means less competition without feeling guilty you didn't try to report it.

VPInsider seems to be a great resource if you want to customize your searches. Still I can't see any justification for the cost.

"Man Babes" #AxelFabulous

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Quote: djatc

VPFree2 is Vegas-centric. That could be because there are so many great games out there, and many of the "pros" live out there too. If they didn't take your submission I guess that means less competition without feeling guilty you didn't try to report it.

VPInsider seems to be a great resource if you want to customize your searches. Still I can't see any justification for the cost.

Well, it was for a Tunica casino, but the end result was weird. They threw it in there as a comment for Horseshoe Tunica, but they still label Horseshoe Tunica as "Nothing Good". They currently have a machine better than say Quad and Flamingo...but Horseshoe Tunica is listed as "Nothing Good" lol. I also first alerted VPFree that the former IP had 7/5 Bonus STP for nickels and higher (their best game); it was listed right along their other 7/5 Bonus units. I won't be adding too much to Vegas since I often am with the g/f and being a strip tourist when I visit, but I probably should tell them that Luxor has 9/6 DDB and 98.91% DW w/STP for dollars and $2. It's just really inconsistent since it's all volunteer.

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Quote: tringlomane

Well, I am a bit bitter with VPFree2 at times because I posted this spring that 5-play "Build a Wheel" existed at Horseshoe Tunica for 9/6 DDB (99.11% w/Build a Wheel). It was relegated to a comment and Horseshoe Tunica still has the dreaded "Nothing Good" status (because all their other games are ~97% or worse). But at least one damn game is above 99%, which is the threshold to them for a "good game"...lol

You must not have read the replies to your post on the vpFREE forum about your Horseshoe Tunica submission to vpFREE2 not being added to the games page. It looks like that was just a mistake by the person updating that casino and the site owner has been notified.

Hope you will continue to contribute to vpFREE2, since you did say that "Every other addition I have submitted has been added though.". As someone else wrote here, vpFREE2 is based on input from the video poker community.

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Haha, nope, hadn't looked until now. I have too many forums lately...bah And it looks like squeaking wheel gets some grease...haha

It's not a huge deal; I just felt ranty yesterday. If DDB wasn't the most popular video poker game by a mile, not including 9/6 DDB wouldn't be as big of a deal either.

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I was playing around on VPfree2 and found that VPInsider might be a value buy if you want to sort game types, denoms, and single/multi-line in an ascending/descending order. VPfree2 only shows a single page with these values that aren't modifiable. Also if cashback/points were on the table it would be a great addition, such as NSUD - 99.73% at Casino X with 0.25% cashback because I always have to tab back and forth to see if it's a good play. If they can divulge the bounceback/cashback sweet spot tiers I would snap buy this as well. Finally of course Ultimate X would be a great addition as VPfree2 is not up on that yet.

"Man Babes" #AxelFabulous

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Quote: djatc

Finally of course Ultimate X would be a great addition as VPfree2 is not up on that yet.

I've seen Ultimate X listed in vpFREE2 at some casinos. Maybe Palms, Hard Rock LV, South Point.

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I would proceed with caution. VPInsider was launched by Skip Hughes, who was derailed by illness, eventually dying in 2010. At that point, the site was picked up by Viktor Nacht/RGE, operators of a more general gambling site called advantageplayer.com, which seems rather quiet. In fact, the (free) video poker forum there hasn't seen a post since early January.

If there's any value to a VPInsider subscription, it's a well-kept secret.

"Scientists tell us that the fastest animal on earth, with a top speed of 120 feet per second, is a cow that has been dropped out of a helicopter."

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Quote: tes3355

I've seen Ultimate X listed in vpFREE2 at some casinos. Maybe Palms, Hard Rock LV, South Point.

From what I've seen on VPFree2.com, what you see depends mostly upon what people post... I remember when I first saw some Quick Quads varieties posted, they were listed with incorrect returns, but the game description and complete pay table was included, so if you were paying attention, you could figure it out. Eventually, the "list" was adjusted to include some of the other specialty games.

Keep offering updates at your local casinos, and keep checking back - maybe other will do the same!

Expectation is the root of all heartache.

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Quick Quads is tricky, because the quad pays sometimes get altered on short pay tables.

Like I believe MGM Grand offers 45 (5-K)/7/5 Bonus for pennies (98.28%). Quads 5-K on "full pay" units pay 46 for 1 though, a whopping 0.4% difference in the return, and it's needed because 45/8/5 would only pay 99.15%.

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